Comments on: Guest Post: The Cranky Sales Engineer on Sales Training

By: chiku biswas

chiku biswas — Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:47:51 +0000

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By: Uncranking Sales Engineers Trainging « Evil Fish

Uncranking Sales Engineers Trainging « Evil Fish — Fri, 06 Feb 2009 13:15:29 +0000

[...] two interesting posts made me think that working with the actual product in the sales kick off works well for all parties. [...]

By: Mark Sigler

Mark Sigler — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 18:31:09 +0000

Don had some excellent comments and I agree with the suggestion, as does Paco, that pre-sales and product management (incl prod mktg) need to learn more about each others responsibilities and challenges.

I’ve been fortunate (and versatile) enough to have tried roles in bus dev (alliances/channels), sales (named accounts), pre-sales, prod mktg and prod mgmt, as well as engineering and IT ops. There are huge gaps in understanding and appreciating the challenges in each role by those who have not tried such. I wish more companies would rotate assignments to foster more teamwork.

By: The Cranky Product Manager Responds to the Cranky Sales Engineer - Part 1 | The Cranky Product Manager

Mon, 02 Feb 2009 13:31:57 +0000

[...] we had an excellent guest post from The Cranky Sales Engineer. The Cranky Product Manager thought much of it was brilliant, but nevertheless some parts irritated [...]

By: Paco

Paco — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 01:09:01 +0000

Big props to Don for taking an SE on rotation. As a PM, it really is cool to hear all the insights an ace SE has from customer engagements, and to have that knowledge on-tap for months (or whatever the rotation period). Cuz the SE deals with a different set of people at the customer site than the PM (with some overlap), you get to hear more gory implementation details.

Ultimately, I’ve only seen one ace SE permanently switch to PM. Some did it for a quarter or two but then, like the others, they go back to being an ace SE. Why? Cuz being an ace SE gets you much more visible props/respect, and more importantly, they usually make a lot more $$ than us chump PMs ;)

I’m waiting with baited breath for whatever fury the CPM is going to release on CSE though. Hopefully the CPM will not disappoint…

By: Greg Glockner

Greg Glockner — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 20:48:33 +0000

Awesome post! Would love to hear again from the Cranky Sales Engineer.

I also agree with the comments from both Nigel & Don.

By: Don MacLennan

Don MacLennan — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 16:17:44 +0000

Great post. I think the product manager-to-SE relationship is worthy of lots of discussion.

Recently, I recruited a top SE to my product management team for a 6-month rotation (yes, we have enough SE’s to afford one taking an assignment). I wanted to turn his complaints into a solution: a well-defined set of requirements that would satisfy his prospects’ unmet needs.

About a month into it, he said, “Wow, you guys really are trying to help us. We thought you just weren’t listening. Getting stuff built is hard.”

My conclusion: walk a mile in each other’s shoes. Product managers: go on the sales calls, *especially* first and second demos before you’re parachuted in to overcome specific show-stoppers. SE’s: see how the sausage gets made. Go to some internal meetings. Understand the scope of requirements gathering that goes on, how prioritizations and trade-offs get made, the intricacies of developing “real” products versus the cool prototypes you built with Ruby on Rails during your layover in Chicago.

I spent 14 years in the field before getting involved in product management & marketing. It never ceases to amaze me how little these groups know about each other’s jobs.

By: Chris Moran

Chris Moran — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:47:27 +0000

Nice writing style. Looking forward to reading more from you.

Chris Moran

By: Nigel Thomas

Nigel Thomas — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 15:28:26 +0000

Good list, though I think the boot may be on the other foot for #7. Having been on both sides of the fence, I reckon the product manager can only bring references that have been delivered by the SE – slightly helped by a decent product in the first place, the salesman who con(vince)d the client and the consultants who did the dirty work.

Regards Nigel

By: Grumpy Software Engineer

Grumpy Software Engineer — Thu, 29 Jan 2009 14:59:00 +0000

Hokay, splain to me Lucy… How do you get a “Top Ten” list out of only seven items?