Comments on: The Cranky Product Manager bitchslaps the Cranky Marketer

By: Gregory Haardt

Gregory Haardt — Sun, 03 May 2009 16:28:07 +0000

Just stumbled on your website. Right down hilarious. Thank you for lifting up the spirit. Gregory Haardt The Clueless Product Manager "A journey to product management wisdom"

By: MichGonzalez

MichGonzalez — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 03:21:59 +0000

@aptuscollab thanks for Cranky PM, she is great, love the Cranky PM and Cranky Marketer http://is.gd/sBMC, for @frymaster too

By: Dr. Jim Anderson

Dr. Jim Anderson — Tue, 21 Apr 2009 00:19:22 +0000

Sigh, and they wonder why we’ll never have peace in the Middle East! I loved the post, but it sorta masked the real problem. Yes, the world has its share of CPMs and CMS – the big question is how to bring them together, not push them apart.

Although a bunch of flowers and a box of chocolate might be one’s first thought, how about something with a little bit more staying power? Ultimately what’s missing from everyone’s 100+ item to-do lists (which will never get done, so why fool yourself and let it grow to 100) is the simple concept of shared goals.

If the CPM and the CM have the same set of goals that they’ll get measured against, then no matter how bad the relationship gets, they’ll always have that to fall back on. If management doesn’t step in and create the goals, then the CPM (yes, it’s your job to do the right thing) needs to sit down with the CM and create the shared goals.

Remember, if it was easy, then anyone could do the job.

- Dr. Jim Anderson
The Accidental PM Blog
“Home Of The Billion Dollar Product Manager”

By: Trevor

Trevor — Sun, 19 Apr 2009 06:07:12 +0000

The Cranky Product Manager vs the Cranky Marketer: http://bit.ly/tScYs

By: Graham Gillen

Graham Gillen — Fri, 17 Apr 2009 17:01:03 +0000

Ken,
A lot has to do with what you *like* to do – which hopefully coincides with what you do best. I have technical degrees that qualified me for programmer / systems analyst type jobs and found I was a good analyst, mediocre programmer. Then I ran a team of Sales Engineers and became addicted to the “thrill” of trying to win deals and I greatly enjoyed customer interaction, so I was on a path further and further away from pure technology. Now the favorite part of my job is doing presentations and I work very hard at trying to get good at them (and doing presos people enjoy).

If you are technical but very outgoing, there seems to be a natural career path (albeit a sideways one) from Programmer Analyst to Sales Engineer / Solutions Architect to Product Manager and sometimes to Product Marketing (in some smaller companies PM and PMM are embodied in one person). If you take this path, you will find that your technical background gives you much more street cred and you are able to enjoy the best of both words (Technical and Customer / Marketing). Realize though that each move has a learning curve and you have to be dedicated to self-improvement and occasionally eating humble pie as you learn.

Put another way, when I was a programmer analyst, my job enjoyment rating was probably a 4. As an SE/SA, it was a 7 (travel was rough). As a PM, it was 7.5 (+1 for less travel, -0.5 for less “thrill”). As PMM, it’s a 9. I feel in my bones this is what I should be doing and hope this leads to a PM/PMM Director and VP role.

I know it’s scary walking away (it seems) from the comfort zone of a pure technologist, but if your personality is really cut out more for PM / PMM, your job satisfaction goes way up.

By: Ken Pomper

Ken Pomper — Fri, 17 Apr 2009 16:40:16 +0000

Taking all things into account (well, excluding their possible role as a stepping stone to somewhere else), are these good jobs (PM and PMM) for the people doing them, on a scale of 1-10 (no fair using negative numbers)? Interested in how it all weighs out, on balance, for other people doing them. The potential to use both the technical and business sides of the brain in some satisfying way is great, but potential and reality can be worlds apart.

By: Maggie

Maggie — Fri, 17 Apr 2009 15:11:34 +0000

Thanks for an awesome post, and Paco, you are on to something…the Hallmark cards idea is great. CPM, thank you for expressing openly what I so often hold in and the voices shout in my head during meetings, and such. I am a Christian so I do try to hold it in, and not fully display on my projector of a face, but in moments of absolute honesty, I scream (again, in my head) all that you wrote down in this post.

Oh, and when you put the cards for sale on the site, I will buy them along with another mug.
Happy Friday!

By: G Gillen

G Gillen — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 22:29:48 +0000

The Japanese have a saying…
“Fix the problem, not the blame”.

I have done all the jobs CM has done, from pro-serv to Product Management to Product Marketing. Between Product Management and Marketing, I will say the former is much more loaded with backbreaking day to day tasks than my current Product Marketing job, so I cannot empathize with CM (as CPM says, boo-f’ing-hoo).

As far as part deux, sure to qualify for upper management or Exec, you have to be subject to RNF’s (Random Neuron Firings) which are usual knee-jerk, dumb initiatives…. but I found that if you have any cohones (regardless of your actually gender), then you should be able to steer upper management in the right direction. They will respect you more for that in the long run.

I agree the CM’s situation is deplorable, but I prefer to think it does no represent everyone’s reality… I have no such major complaints.

By: gander

gander — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 01:45:39 +0000

@Paco – Awesome idea.

By: NWGuy

NWGuy — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 01:43:28 +0000

@crankypm WOW – back with a bang! huge difference between marketing and marcom/sales support http://is.gd/sBMC good to see you back